In The News: COGIC Music Dept. Issues Statement About Kim Burrell
by EJ on Feb.18, 2010 at 3:38 pm, under Christian
I just received an official statement from Dr. Judith McAllister, President of the International Music Department of the Church Of God In Christ. In it, she clarifies the position of the COGIC International Music Department regarding the recent criticism and scrutiny of the new “secular music” endeavors of Kim Burrell, the Department’s Vice President.
The statement includes statements from Kim Burrell made during a conference call.
Check it out:
Thoughts???
-
Welcome to GospelPundit.com!
It's the NEW blog for gospel music lovers. Get comfy and don't be shy-- whether you check daily or it's your first time here, you're NEVER too late for the discussions!
Read the posts, leave some comments and ENJOY!
Subscribe:
You'll get an email about the day's posts!
-
-
-
-
Lyrical Trivia
“Lord, Your grace… covering me like a soft summer shower
Raining down on me, goodness and mercy,
Loving me daily, forgiving me freely.”
Who Said It? 5 Comments
-
Sponsored Links:
GetBonnerfide.com
Check out the new face in event photography.
Get Ready. Get Set. Get Bonnerfide.
SidemanConsulting.com
Need assistance with your music career?
Put award-winning experience on your side.
February 18th, 2010 on 3:45 pm
Real Confused……
February 18th, 2010 on 3:46 pm
I commend President McAllister in her decision to stand by Kim Burrell. This is such an awesome opportunity for the advancement of God’s agenda through the vessel of Kim Burrell. The harvest is truly plentuous……..the light will shine even in darkness. Night has just been penetrated by that voice we’ve become used to……weeping has endured for the night season but here comes joy in the morning. GO KIM!!!!!!!!! Take it by force.
February 18th, 2010 on 3:46 pm
Wow!!! We needed an official statement? Ha ha ha!!! I love the church! More concerned about this, than the souls who are dying daily IN the 4 walls. Let’s concentrate on building WARRIORS for the Kingdom. Regardless of what type of music Ms. Burrell does, she has always shown to be an example of the Kingdom. Why should or would we change our opinion of her because of something someone “stretched” in the media?
February 18th, 2010 on 3:48 pm
I’m not sure that this letter clears up a whole lot. She’s says she’s not singing secular music. She also didn’t say “I’m singing Gospel music”. It’s not secular and it’s not Gospel. Maybe she’s creating her own genre.
It is clear that her music is going to go in a different direction. Let’s just keep her in our prayers and see what the end result is.
February 18th, 2010 on 3:49 pm
AWESOME!!!!!!! This by far is the kind of support that should be shown to individuals who step out of the box and the confines of what people deem is “correct”. The key line that Dr. McAllister wrote in her “communique” is “we should rejoce in the fact that God has entrusted our dear sister, Vice President Kim Burrell, with an assignment in a new vineyard”. Yes! I couldn’t agree more with that statement! I don’t believe Burrell would step out w/out hearing from God…even without knowing her personally. We have to stop judging folks who make moves like those without hearing the heart/spirit behind it.
February 18th, 2010 on 3:52 pm
sadly, this statement will not be enough to silence the critics. alright for the COGIC PR Department, lol.
*unchecks notification box*
February 18th, 2010 on 4:04 pm
I’m confused. So she says “I’m dedicated to God, dedicated to ministry. I’m dedicated to the anointing that God has on my life. I will never, ever compromise that directly or indirectly.” So does this mean she is NOT going to sing secular then? Because what kind of “anointing” or “ministry” will come forth in secular song. I need her to sit down with GospelPundit.com & give an exclusive interview.
February 18th, 2010 on 4:09 pm
LOL @ real confused!
At the end of the 2nd paragraph, I think Kim’s saying that those who don’t sing gospel music are not necessarily singing songs that go against Christian principles (though many Christians make that assumption) and that their choice not to sing gospel doesn’t exclude them from getting into heaven (if their songs do go along with Christian principles). I agree. Now the 3rd paragraph…I may need an interpreter for, lol. I’m not sure what she was trying to say. It almost seems like she’s saying that ‘they’ had to give it a label and that’s what ‘they’ called it…not that it’s what she calls it…it being the type of music she’ll be recording.
But I get the sense from this that she will be singing about human experiences within the limits of a godly lifestyle. If she intends to keep her position in the COGIC church, I’m confident that she’ll do that.
So with that, I’m cool. For now…until I hear the end result.
I respect and appreciate her and the COGIC church for making a statement. Very cool of them…
February 18th, 2010 on 4:11 pm
I just wanna know what made her put them fish net stocking on in that pic!!! On her website she has change some words up, because, at first it said she will be doing her first secular album, now its gone!! Look at God
Go Kim Burrell, yet still confused.
February 18th, 2010 on 4:11 pm
I don’t understand why it was even necessary for her to make a statement. The church is really a trip! She doesn’t owe anyone an explanation. All she should do is go forth with what God has told HER to do, not the COGIC or the saints.
February 18th, 2010 on 4:19 pm
ummm…. what in the world?!
February 18th, 2010 on 4:22 pm
Soooo …….. in essence, REAL TALK what is she saying? WITHOUT all the bells, whistles and foo foo la. Is she singing secular or not?
February 18th, 2010 on 5:25 pm
I am with you all who are confused by this press release. Im guessing there will not be a secular cd.
smh.
February 18th, 2010 on 6:07 pm
I’m bragging on the Lord when I say (and it is true) that I have a MASTER’S DEGREE in organizational/public relations and WHOEVER recommended this letter gets a big F for FAIL.
The fail comes from at least two points:
1. the TARGET(S) of the release are unclear. To whom is this information targeted? COGIC? Gospel music industry? Hollywood? The World? The universe? The Lord Jesus Christ Himself? I mean who?
2. the PURPOSE(S) of the release are unclear. Has Kim’s image been damaged in any way? Have record sales plummeted? Has anyone in the COGIC nat’l choir backslid because Kim Burrell and secular were in the same sentence?
Sigh… at the end of the day, Kim is going to do what she feels she needs to do. I’m not going to police her salvation. I never like the excuse about going into the world to minister to them. Say you want to collaborate for the music, and if/when your Holy Ghost rises up, that’s what will draw the people to Jesus.
February 18th, 2010 on 6:16 pm
secular has evolved into such a scary word for church folk. just because kim has decided to record a non-gospel album does not mean she’s going to sing about booty popping, my lip gloss is poppin’, etc. just relax, relate, release…woooo-sah
not sure of the age range of most of the readers on this site, but years ago when teen summit aired on BET, i remember fred hammond talking about singing on commercials. i recall him saying something to the effect that if he was not blaspheming God and promoting sin, he didn’t see a problem with singing on non-gospel tracks. did ya’ll flip out when yolanda sang for that chrysler commercial? or what about bebe singing for hair care products (isoplus)? or maybe when fred or kirk’s voices were on commercials? my suggestion – stop thinking “secular” as an x-rated word in the church.
oh and the release was just unnecessary…
February 18th, 2010 on 6:18 pm
This is amazing. She had to compose an official statement? I’ve grown up in church my whole life and it still amazes me that people were so offended by the “secular song” she ministered. I am saddened by this.
February 18th, 2010 on 6:18 pm
@ Tam Tam….1000 percent in agreement.
February 18th, 2010 on 6:50 pm
Im tired of cover up in the church.. coming from old Holiness being saved, set free and sanctified the WORD said come out from among them.. You can straddle the fence to reach another person..No matter how you take the scripture to fit for your own use..With her new found weight loss come different actions. dont forget who allowed you to loose the dead weight you carry and also I feel the letter is a cover up from Dr McAlister friends do that.. Kim herself needs to clarify her actions otherwise in the words of my parents, big momma grandmother elders of the church she is backsliding.. No more Spiritual politicalness.. Do it God way or dont do it at all…but in the end you will suffer
February 18th, 2010 on 6:52 pm
What Makes ANY Child of GOD think that You have to Go Outside of the Will of GOD and Compromise Your Relatioship with Christ to Save those that Aren’t Saved? First of All, We as the Body of Christ Don’t have the Power to SAVE ANYBODY. ONLY GOD can SAVE!
It was His Blood that was Shed on that CROSS, NOT Kim Burrells or Anyone Elses. My Bible Reads that ONLY WHAT YOU DO FOR CHRIST WILL LAST, EVERYTHING ELSE WILL PERISH AWAY.
Furthermore, A DOUBLE MINDED MAN IS UNSTABLE IN ALL OF HIS WAYS!!!!. When You Began to Become Double Minided, You Begin to DOUBLE TALK.
GOD IS NOT THE AUTHOR OF CONFUSION*
February 18th, 2010 on 6:53 pm
Im not judging but again this letter of communication is a cover up…
February 18th, 2010 on 6:55 pm
Hum…don’t know how I feel about this one….
Clearly, Kim’s website said SECULAR…now…it has mysteriously changed to CREATING AN ALBUM FOR AUDIENCES WORLDWIDE.
If she had not initially put the word SECULAR out there, this uproar would not have taken place.
This is total chaos and confusion…we can’t blame a webmaster or a PR person – Kim holds a responsibility to make sure that her image is solid when info is posted.
It does crack me up though, that the COGIC headquarters felt the need to put out a press release. At the same time, I can’t blame McCallister because I’m sure that she has received TONS of emails about the issue. So, it certainly was a good way for her to cover herself.
I don’t know…to me, Kim didn’t really clarify anything…seems to me that she spoke more on the dedication to COGIC and her position…
February 18th, 2010 on 7:05 pm
@ Renee…maybe they have been reading the comments on Gospel Pundit for the last two weeks:)
February 18th, 2010 on 7:11 pm
It’s funny to me that both sides are jumping to conclusions and no one has heard a single note from the actual album.
February 18th, 2010 on 7:16 pm
I know that this is a hard pill for you COGIC, Holiness is right people who never commit sin. Just because she sings secular music doesn’t mean she isn’t anointed. I am a Christian and I love the Lord and I listen to all kinds of music. Remember, God created music. It was satan that perverted it. So if you have a problem with Kim Burrell singing secular, ask youself a question, what problem do you have with yourself? Oh I imagine you don’t because you live holy everyday, think holy and never sin and if that’s the case, you need to pack your bags and tell the Lord to come get you because you have no use here on earth anymore. Listen when the CD Drops, I’ll be the first to get it. You have a choice. You don’t have to buy it or listen to it. With all of the other stuff going on in the world this is not that important to talk negative about her gift. You all are the reason why people don’t go to church. The church is worse than those who do not even attend! This is crazy and it seems as if the people inside the 4 walls of the church is getting worse day by day.
February 18th, 2010 on 7:25 pm
This was definitely a missed opportunity for the COGIC faith to have some serious dialogue the subject of self-proclaimed Christian who sing secular music. Is all secular music bad and/or demonic? What about about love songs that are non-sexual and celebrate love in its purist form or discuss the trials of relationships? Is that not reality? My interpretation of the letter is that the COGIC faith is giving Kim Burrell the “benefit of doubt” regarding her musical career based on her obvious anointing – her works and reputation in the ministry thus far. That is what they are doing… However, because the chuch has drawn such a hard line in the sand about self-proclaimed Christian who sing secular music we have no wiggle room to rethink our position – have some revelation about the matter and possibly alter our belief and understanding. This would have been a teachable moment I think.
February 18th, 2010 on 7:31 pm
@Marcel
I soooo agree with you. They really didnt accomplish much by releasing the letter. Oh and I still dont know what Kim is really going to sing.
February 18th, 2010 on 8:15 pm
Let’s be honest, Kim was going to have to address the situation at some point sooner or later. You can’t just go throughout your whole career declaring that the thought of singing secular music was never in the realm of possibility. Then your brand new website premieres with a newly sexed up image announcing your upcoming secular album. Huh? What? So in a way, this press release was necessary IMO.
This has been the Hot Topic in gospel for the last month. Look at the firestorm of discussion it created on THIS site alone. I can imagine how many emails and calls that Dr. McAllister, Bishop Blake, and other COGIC officials have received. However, it’s kinda made things even MORE confusing because it didn’t answer the bottomline question.
February 18th, 2010 on 8:45 pm
Darned if you do darned if you don’t…
I wish I was surprised by some of these comments BUT sadly I am not. The letter SHOULD not have been NEEDED but CLEARLY it was…just based on these posts alone. It was clear – Kim said she isn’t backsliding. She probably had the secular word changed cuz of “church folks” and “super saints”
In the interviews I’ve heard she’s referred to the record as inspirational…and if no one else has noticed, Kim hasn’t had the best sales in gospel, it’s about time she broaden her horizons and make some $$$ while sharing her God given gift with the world…HMPH
February 18th, 2010 on 9:00 pm
I am really saddened because this is why people don’t come to church and this is why people backslide. Everyone is soooooo worried about what the next person is doing. Allow God to be that person’s compass…who are we to put people in or out of God’s will? Kim stated her position and people are still yappin’. There’s never enough with ‘the saints’ – they are not satisfied until they kill off everything breathing because of their traditional and sometimes unfounded beliefs. Then to top it off…’imma be prayin for her or him’, when you spent the first part of the dialogue gossiping.
At the end of the day all of us will stand before God for ourselves and not for what somebody else did. Get over yourselves and get yourself together. If everyone did that, we would not have time to notice what the other is doing. The world would be a happier place.
February 18th, 2010 on 9:36 pm
Saints, it is very prevalent that Evangelist Kim Burell has an annointing in & over her life that would move her inner- man to launch out into the deep. The word of God tells us in Luke 14:23 and the Lord said unto the servant, Go out into the highways and the hedges, and compel them to come in, that my house will be filled. What does compel mean? To force, provoke, persuade, encourage; in which these are characteristics that Kim Burell posesses as a awesome psalmist. The world is looking for the right person or people that can meet them right where they are. Kim Burell is about her Fathers buisness ministering to those who may have no hope, down & confused. A song becomes secular when no one hears the name Jesus in it.. It does not mean that they are not singing about the Lord but it is what others perceive about the song. It does not take away the gift in her but it allows her or others like her to set an example of Holiness which we all should be perfecting.
February 18th, 2010 on 9:36 pm
I really believe that us PENTECOSTALS are so Judgemental… We use Matt. 28:19 to Baptize but we dont live by it, which is exactly what Kim is doing! If we as Christians would stop Preaching to the choir and go out and try to win the souls of those the Church Labels as Sinners and or secular we could really spark a revival in this Nation! The Scriptures say that without Love you have nothing, AND Love covers a Multitude of sin… SAINTS WHERE IS THE LOVE???!!!! our traditional man made rituals and ways, and Hellish lives are nothing but a Free Flight to Hell!! I SUPPORT YOU PASTOR KIM BURRELL!!
February 18th, 2010 on 9:42 pm
@ Norman I agree that sometimes the church is judgmental. However, we should be careful how we (christians) dog “the church.” The same way we say church people dog “the world” we (the more liberal) have a tendency to judge people in the church who have a standard.
Everyone is not always worried about what the next person is doing… it’s just that to whom much is given much is required. The church in general and a great deal of the gospel music industry in particular look at Kim as having a standard. Now… if you were in cogic and someone asked you who is the vice president of the music department and you took them to the picture on Kim’s site… what do think they would say. “oh she’s dressed sexy . I’m gonna get saved.” Come on … let’s be real it doesn’t add up. They need to say what it is and stop playing.
When Kim went to sing for Whitney she didn’t have a secular album and they called her. So…. is a secular album really necessary to reach the world? Maybe she should call it what it is. She’s making a major career move.
February 18th, 2010 on 10:53 pm
Thank you Judy and being sincere with your fellow sister in Christ. This is better than those people who for the past several weeks stood in judgment against Kim because she is not a “perfect sanctified Christian” in some people’s eyes. As I said before, none of us are no better than Kim and we are all sinners saved by grace.
I’m not trying to be critical of the pentecostal faith and others (COGIC, PAW, Word of Faith, etc), but just because a person (like Kim) cannot to adhere to your definition of your standards (no make up, cannot go to the outside world and have to stay inside the four walls of the church and hang around with Christians only) they are no less of a christian than many of you.
These are the same critics who hate people like Mary Mary, the Winans, Yolanda Adams and the list goes on and on and instead of supporting them and praying for them, you all rag on them just because they want to do something different in their career.
And these same “Church folk” who are critical of them do not have a clue and have issues themselves which they ask God to take care of. As the Williams Brothers would say back in the day, “We need to sweep on your back door instead of sweeping around mines.”
Bishop Blake has confidence in Kim. Dr. Mc Allister has confidence in Kim. Why don’t church folk do not have confidence in her, I don’t know.
The Body of Christ should grow up and stop having these critical spirits every time someone decides to do something out of the box.
If I touched a nerve or made someone mad, I’m truly sorry.
February 18th, 2010 on 10:54 pm
It’s amazing how some of us think we are entitled to have complete and total access to whatever vision or revelation God has spoken and given to Kim Burrell. NONE of us know exactly what she is about birth and the only way we are going to find out is by WAITING.
This reminds of that passage of scripture in Acts 5 when Peter and the other Apostles were being persecuted and their attackers where both scared and confused by the gospel that they preached. The Pharisee Gamaliel said this in Acts 5:38-39
“Leave these men alone! Let Them Go! For if their purpose is of human origin…IT WILL FAIL. But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourself fighting against God!”
Stop speaking against what you yourself don’t understand. Many of you are making judgments and proclamations against her and then you turn around in the same mind and say that “you are confused about what she’s trying to accomplish”. If you don’t have all the facts, why not wait for clarity and enlightenment before throwing out scriptures and harsh words to counteract something that you aren’t even sure is happening?
Who here is actually a supporter of Kim Burrell’s ministry? I’m not talking about those of you who love her runs, her style, her singing or her ability to make you quicken and hop with one riff..I’m talking those of you who are actually supporters of the MINISTRY of Kim Burrell? Who here is actually PRAYING for Kim Burrell?
Trying praying people UP before you talk them DOWN.
We make things more of an issue when we SPEAK before we UNDERSTAND. In all thy getting, get understanding! (Prvb. 4:7)
February 18th, 2010 on 10:58 pm
Blah, blah, blah. Oh and um….. blah, blah, blah. Seriously? Can we just hear some good, positive music? With all this hype I am sure Kim will debut #1 on the Gospel charts and place on the R & B charts as well. Kim is very talented and has fans that listens to all genres.
February 18th, 2010 on 11:01 pm
Ok, okay they made their point! As a christian I have to make choices daily and look at the conquences which is healthy for me. I am not in the position to judge anyone but myself , I listen to gospel, jazz, and r&b and I know what I liked. Ms. Kim needs our support we can give it to her or not. Whitney sung both gospel and secular and I enjoyed her music to. Once again it appears our christian artist are going secular for a larger audience, it would had been better if they did secular first than gospel later like everyone else. I wish u well Kim only God can Judge you! and a tree is know by its fruit that it bears so my pray for you and every other christian artist is be faithful to God and know who u belong to. Much is given, Much is required… amen
February 18th, 2010 on 11:08 pm
@ Har’ell,
That is one of the wiser posts I’ve read thus far. I think we as church folk want to judge their own.
And no wonder gospel artists do not get support because it is so many instances of infighting and especially with christians of color.
February 19th, 2010 on 12:42 am
This letter sound like the fine print that you see when you sign up for a credit card. What with all this double talk?If Kim Burrell wants to sing worldly music that’s fine,music will not put you in hell or keep you from entering heaven. If Kim Burrell wants to widen her fan base and fatten her pocketbook thats her choice,that’s her decision.She needs to stop hiding behind a smoke screen and be straight forward about her intention. Matt.26:41 said Watch and pray,the Bible also speaks of a great falling away from the body of Christ. Jesus also was tempted by the devil,I will give thee all the kingdoms of the world and the glory of the world.(Matt.4:8-9)Judge not? John 8:26 Judge not according to the appearance,but judge righteous judgement.Judge people according to their deeds and action,their fruits.
February 19th, 2010 on 3:17 am
I dont know why people trip when they hear the words secular…..well i do lol cuz the current music thats out there now is horrible but I feel like that if Kim Burrell create music the way it used to be where it wasnt talking about sex and comitting sucide then there shouldnt be an issue. All music is…is a form of expressing our inner thoughts I feel like being that Kim is a christian her music will always reflect her being a christian whether she’s doing secular or gospel….gospel folks need to stop trippin for real im sure this will be an inspirational album
February 19th, 2010 on 6:05 am
Kinda confused too but in all honesty I think part of the reason why Kim Burrell has attracted so much negative press is cos of the timing inwhich she announced her endeavour….I mean she drops a whole lotta weight…takes pictures in fish net tights and an outfit that isnt age appropriate for her( and which we’ve NEVER seen her in) and at the same time she announces her intention to do secular music. Of course saints are gonna b concerned …….kinda surprised at Judith McCallisters stance but hey in the church these days it seems anything goes and even standards at pastoral levels have dropped let alone a music dept…..All I’ll say is I’ma keep working out MY salvation with fear and tremblign and keep my eyes fixed on JESUS the author and finisher of my faith cos hmmm if you’re lookign unto church leadership u’ll be sooooo confused!!!
February 19th, 2010 on 7:15 am
@Kwartema! AMEN!! Gotta look to Jesus… the church has no standard anymore. If you in anyway try to do the bible you get criticized as being narrow minded, in a box, and needing balance. The CHURCH doesn’t even want you to be the CHURCH anymore. I thought we were supposed to be on God’s side? If God leads you to sing something that’s not considered Gospel — so what… He’s God, but don’t try to make me feel guilty for not supporting you. I read “secular” on her website with my own eyes. I saw her posing w/ the fishnets, even the letter is one of defense. I thought we were supposed to defend the gospel?
GOD has blessed Kim Burrell with a phenomenal gift and if she believes God is leading her “to another vineyard” — so be it. I’ll stick with the bible, that’s what will last. To whom much is given, much is required.
February 19th, 2010 on 7:29 am
John 12:32
“And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me.”
February 19th, 2010 on 7:51 am
This entire thread is hilarious. Everything from “go ‘head Kim” to “this was totally unnecessary” to “she’s going to hell”. I think the VARIETY of opinions on this page alone show you why this statement was needed.
The statement was to help the saints understand that Kim has not backslidden. She clearly states her love for God, her continued lifestyle of holiness, and her committment to her church and even submission to its leaders. That is to be commended.
I trust, from all we’ve known of Kim previously, that whatever she brings to the table is not going to be in anyway contradictory to the Word or even to good morals. Now, if it ends up being something vulgar, I’ll stand corrected. However, I seriously doubt it.
There is a standard of holiness, and I do believe that some gospel singers straddle or even cross that line, but I do not believe the line is crossed just because someone is not going to be singing “church” music.
February 19th, 2010 on 7:59 am
I also thought about another point. Does anyone remember when the Dr. Clark and the Clark Sisters were shunned for singing at the Grammys?? They were full dressed from head to toe (literally), sang a STRAIGHT CHURCH song, and didn’t compromise anything other than being in the same room with secular artists. Dr. Clark was warned never to do anything like that again and she didn’t perform with the Clark Sisters anymore after that. Well, this sure shows how far the church as a whole (not just COGIC) has come doesn’t it? LOL
I think in church we sometimes overreact to things. Then I think sometimes we underreact to things…where’s the balance between holding up the standard and still realizing that “non-church” does not equal “evil”?
February 19th, 2010 on 8:12 am
Well said Har’ell…
I am proud of the stance that Dr. Mcallister took and I’m not just saying that just because I am COGIC. We don’t know what God has spoken to Kim and what He wants to do through her. If God didn’t give you a ‘word’ for Kim’s life and the direction that it’s going in, than just pray that she maintains her standard. Truth be told, it really doesn’t matter what any of us thinks because no devil in hell can stop the will of God! If you don’t want to hear the music, don’t purchase a cd and don’t download. If you want to hear it (like myself-love Kim
), then sit back and enjoy.
February 19th, 2010 on 8:28 am
I also am quite confused about the purpose of this communication.
If I read correctly she started by was condemning the church for making her unsaved friends in the music industry uncomfortable inside the church for their lifestyle choices? She stated that they had not given their lives to Christ yet, but hinted that we should be doing something (not clear what that is) to make them comfortable and show them that they are not disqualified from living w/Jesus forever? Confused.
Then she goes to say that we are supposed to be soul winners (I agree, but believe we do the winning work outside and we bring the won soul to the house of God with us; we should be equipped inside the church walls to do that effectively) and then she goes into a rant on the defense of the word “secular” in the “church world” — a word that she had on her website a while back (as if someone made it up and accused her of something). WHAT? And then finally she assures us that she recognizes the anointing of God on her life and will obey God and support the IMD, the COGIC and it’s leadership.
All I have to say is that SHE STARTED IT. She put up the website. She said she was going to start singing secular. She put on the racy outfit.
I do understand one thing and agree with Dr. McAllister, Kim Burell needs much prayer. I’ll do that and pray God’s will be done in her life. Join me.
February 19th, 2010 on 8:38 am
MYOB.
February 19th, 2010 on 8:52 am
@SB. Be glad to, but I’ll betcha nobody wants me to that you want me to buy your music and come hear you when you come to town.
That’s why this is an issue. If nobody knew who she was and she didn’t want people to support her, we wouldn’t even be talking about it!
February 19th, 2010 on 9:19 am
Look saints- all secular music is not evil. So let’s listen to the music first before we make a judgment call. TEST ALL THINGS- and hold on to that which is good! (I Thes. 5:21)
February 19th, 2010 on 9:29 am
Obviously, Judy was approached and had to officially address the issue being an officer of the church. Unfortuantely, if you want to hold an office in a church, no matter the denomination, there are guidelines that are upheld whether we agree with them or not. In our quest to protect the holiness of the “church”, we seem to forget that there is a dying world out there . There are souls that will never set foot in a church, and we may be the only bible that a person reads and the only Jesus that they see. Kim is serious about her music ministry and she is going to be a light in dark places. God Bless Her!
February 19th, 2010 on 10:10 am
Handwriting is on the wall.
February 19th, 2010 on 10:35 am
My thing is….if she’s going to go forth with a secular album — go on Kim. But DO NOT disguise this as a way of compelling the world to Christ! To say so, would be in contradiction to what the Word of God has said. God is NOT a man that he should lie and I’m not convinced that He would tell his sheep to act in opposition of His will already outlined in the Word. Come on now saints. Who are you trying to fool? Let’s be real, Kim is doing it for MONEY and FAME. How can music with no mention of our Lord & Savior be called “ministry” and a “new” way to lead the world in? That makes no sense earthly or spiritually. You are absolutely correct that not all secular is “devil music” but it ain’t no “ministry” neither!! Keep it real.
February 19th, 2010 on 10:44 am
I could only read half of this crap that some of you are writing…… and my comments to yall……HAVE A SEAT AND WORRY ABOUT WHAT YOU ARE DOING IN THE KINGDOM…..KIM IS DOING AMAZING THINGS IN THE KINGDOM….REACHING THOSE OUTSIDE OF THE 4 WALLS OF THE CHURCH….I COMMEND HER!!!!!!!!!!..”Go ye into ALLLLLLLL the world and spread the GOOD NEWS”!!!!!
February 19th, 2010 on 11:16 am
It’s apparent to me that this is not God. Look at the confusion its causing. He’s not the author of that. I’m not criticizing Kim but there just seems to be a lot of “wavering.” When will the church learn you can’t draw the world by giving them what they’ve already got and using their tactics? As unpopular as it is now…Jesus said if I BE LIFTED UP….that’s the Word. You can argue that and try explain that if you will, but its plain and simple. God Bless Kim and God Bless the Church of God IN Christ.
February 19th, 2010 on 12:28 pm
Doesn’t the bible say “he that wins a soul is WISE”…..I don’t think staying in the 4 walls of the church, all the time, preachin’ to recycled “church folk” is wise……..It’s time for us to step out….We all know good and well that Kim is SAVED fa real!…….The only “confused” people are those ‘RELIGEOUS and STUCK church goers…..ALL THIS HYPE over something that hasn’t even happened yet!……smh
February 19th, 2010 on 12:32 pm
In the interviews I’ve heard she’s referred to the record as inspirational…and if no one else has noticed, Kim hasn’t had the best sales in gospel, it’s about time she broaden her horizons and make some $$$ while sharing her God given gift with the world…HMPH
hey now grammi!
I’m yet confused.. so how is going secular going to increase her sales? If she makes the music she wants to make, and it’s good — does it matter whether it’s labeled gospel or secular? Her name and the music should sale? Right? #kanyeshrug I’m just guessin..
She started out with Everlasting Life and crushed — then everything after was mediocre (along with labels folding, poor distribution, etc). So that’s why she aint sellin. Let’s call it for what it is.
I personally think this is a case of a new publicist or team that needs to pump their breaks and be a lil easy with how they present ole KB and her new image. They jumped out the gate doing too much.
February 19th, 2010 on 12:35 pm
oooh
well, technically “Everlasting” wasn’t the first but yall know what I mean.. lol
February 19th, 2010 on 12:56 pm
Well whatever Kim decides to release I will continue to support her.
February 19th, 2010 on 2:09 pm
@ Lou – you’re right…it was “Try me Again”.
And I am a 100% supporter of Kim Burrell. If you have ever heard an interview done by Kim, she also prefers to preach over singing.
No matter some folks down her or question what she’s doing, She is covered and I know we ALL can see it. I don’t even know her personally but she is COVERED.
I’m praying for you Kim and your new journey. DEFINITELY will be purchasing your CD when it debut’s.
)
February 19th, 2010 on 2:34 pm
Ummmm yeah……….. compromise
February 19th, 2010 on 2:48 pm
I don’t doubt that if Kim’s CD goes Platinum and she makes millions of dollars the COGIC won’t turn down her tithes because it came from “Secular” music. Who knows where anybody’s money comes from? Like the offering plate that’s passed around 1 more time “cause we need $50.00 more dollars” This subject keeps going around and around and just like what you give, this should be between Kim and the Lord. None of us have a Heaven or Hell to put anybody in.
February 19th, 2010 on 3:13 pm
why do people belive you have to conform to worldly standards to bring sinners in? did Jesus change who he was or his message to save souls? I dont think so….He held to the holiness standard and souls were won! I dont know KB or whats going on in her life but prayer changes things so lets just do that….all i know is that TRUE HOLINESS IS RIGHT!!
February 19th, 2010 on 8:53 pm
Secular music,worldly music there is no different! How can you minister to God’s people using methods the world use to fill their pockets with money,so they can stand in the spot light and say look at me.Rappers,movies star, football,basketball players they all thank God for their success during these award shows,but afterward they partying to the break of dawn,what a mockery,to use God name in vain. There is a good success,God way(Joshua 1:08)and a success the world will reward you with.I’m a musician,I play gospel music only,and not all gospel music lift up the name of Jesus.I don’t know Kim Burrell but we cross paths many times,I even attend some of her singing classes.She is a gifted singer with a exceptional voice.I believe she have a loving and caring heart,but this all about riches,and the big stage that will put you over and above in life.Pray for her!
February 19th, 2010 on 8:59 pm
Ok gang–Jazz, R&B and other forms of music came from–you guessed it, gospel music. What is the problem people? Is the problem that one of your own just because she is recording a secular album she is burned to the stake now by fellow believers?
We need to grow up everyone-and that’s including the body of Christ.
February 19th, 2010 on 10:04 pm
well we have so many CRITICAL people on the church and they will talk and talk and i think it’s wrong and sad to see christans bump heads at eachother over things like this. i still love kim and i always have and will be. Blessings.
February 20th, 2010 on 5:34 am
Really, seriously ALL THIS over 1 song y”all? There are soooo many others that I’m sure you all would call “gospel singers” that sing songs on “gospel CD’s” with NO MENTION of God, Jesus, the Lord ON PURPOSE so they can both be played on “secular” stations and bought by “the world”. I just think Kim sang one of the songs Whitney has sang in the past and she worked it out!!!!! As far as the dress, yes, all of us raised in the church and from the “old school” would have a problem with it, (me too in the past) but y’all, for real, there is soooo much kingdom work we need to be doing so souls can be saved..We all need to pray and sweep around our own front doors!!!
February 20th, 2010 on 10:11 am
^Karol Ann, this is not over Kim’s performance at the BET Honors. Maybe you missed the announcement of Kim creating her first secular album last month. This is what the letter & all the discussion is about.
Link: http://www.gospelpundit.com/word-has-it-kim-burrells-new-look-new-life-10697
February 20th, 2010 on 11:38 am
Man, I am a 25 year old minister, I also write and sing. I don’t say that to brag, i only say that so you guys will understand my position. I want you guys to consider how soooooo much of what we have been doing as “church” is not what God intended. THE WORD is the standard, not bylaws for a denomination! Like someone said, people are out hear dying and one reason the church don’t always have itself together is because we’re focusing on all these WRONG things. We tear our own folk down the hardest. Please tell me what Kim wearing Fishnets has to do with your relationship with God (Man looks on the outward appearence, God looks at the heart).
She’s being held accountable by her leaders and most of all God. . DON’T BE JEALOUS/SELFISH , THIS ALBUM AINT FOR YOU , YOU ALREADY KNOW JESUS & YOU ALREADY HAVE 4 KIM ALBUMS!!! (which you probably burned, lol) & someone said something about how can a secular song be “anointed.” Anointed means set aside for use, how many remakes have gospel artist and/or mainstream artist done? What about Stevie Wonder and a host of other “secular” artist who ARE anointed? (if your go to a Fantasia or Anthony hamilton show, they’ll have you in worship, LITERALLY) When Moses was building the tabernacle, what changed about the cup or the furniture, except it had been anointed with oil and set aside for use. If God touches it, its anointed!!!! lol So maybe what we deem “secular” is not so, thats just an easy shallow label. some gospel music ain’t biblically correct (that would be a great column EJ) No, we WON’T ALL GET A MANSION study that scripture for yourself, lol
Our problem is, we don’t know the Book that we’re supposed to live by. The GREAT commision is to go OUT INTO ALL THE WORLD…I’ve been to many functions where we will hold an altar call open for an hour, and no one comes down (well, eventually somebody will to shut the person on the mic up or after being yelled at for an hour) but the reason why is cause…..EVERYBODY THERE IS SAVED. What gangsta is gonna come to a musical? lol
I work with kids in the community and on my job I’m not allowed to “church” them, but i sure can live a lifestyle that will inspire them and make them ask me what i have? We’re supposed to be salt and light in darkness, IN the world, but not OF it. Sadly, alot of us may never maximize the potential of God wants to do through us because we’ve been “churched” to death (literally no life). If the wealth of the wicked is laid up for the righteous, shouting for three hours isn’t gonna make the drug dealer wanna bless you, encouraging them with your life and friendship might. To be a friend of THE WORLD (the system) is emnity against God, but Jesus was a FRIEND TO SINNERS. We don’t know our book
(I don’t usually comment on these things, so i kind of overdid it, lol).
February 20th, 2010 on 12:20 pm
You know, I was watching TBN this past week and jazz artist Jonathan Butler talked about after he got saved he wanted to be in the church only, but God told him that he need to continue going to secular venues, which are Jazz clubs and cruses and other places where the people are at. Christians do not understand that Jesus was in places where the people who was unchurched.
Jay, you hit it on the nose. Denominations divides us with their by-laws. And the Christian life is not do’s and don’ts. But we as believers tend to put people in a “box” or to say, put “Christ” in a box and thinking about our interpretation of a person and what should a person do because she or he does not fulfill our interpretation of how a christian should act.
Heck, Arthur Blessitt took the cross everywhere he went, and yes, people responded. Greg Laurie took the gospel in venues where people will not come to the church and is still doing it, taking a page from Billy Graham’s book.
Why black folk have a problem with someone who is trying to reach the unchurched and artists like Kim, I don’t know.
February 20th, 2010 on 3:19 pm
Hey Kim Burrell, as long as your music heals, uplifts and inspires people you don’t need to sweat it! If God confirmed the next album project then why feel the need to address your critics who are made of flesh? On the other hand, I think COGIC leaders should also write letters on behalf of all ministry leaders and Pastors who have been victimized by outsiders. The public can stone and speak ill of our spiritual leaders when they speak the word of God, yet COGIC leaders will remain mute with no support. I’ve noticed this and it’s tragic. Why publish a letter of support for one and not others? Support the Ministry of Jesus Christ and all those who spread the Gospel to save Souls! Make GOD SMILE and say WELL DONE COGIC!
February 20th, 2010 on 8:27 pm
@Jay, you didn’t over do it. You gave to us straight with no chaser. God Bless You My Brother!
February 20th, 2010 on 8:36 pm
Thanks for the letter Kim. As a leader and minister (isn’t she assistant pastor at some church in Texas), she kinda owes some kind of explanation–to her members and fans. And I applaud any church body who decides to stand up to anyone who might malign their image due to some misguided choices of its leaders/members. I’m not sure I understand what Kim Burrell is doing, but she is walking a fine line…and she seems to vacillate a great deal in this letter. When I finished reading it, I still didn’t know where she stood or what she meant.
However, she is just one of the many signs this year, that Christ’s return is sooner than we think. Lrt’s stay prayerful, folks and let’s get ready for the ride.
February 20th, 2010 on 11:56 pm
i can tell you all this but…….Jay tells it all and i agree with him 100% …nuff said.
February 20th, 2010 on 11:57 pm
Novella i agree!
February 21st, 2010 on 12:17 am
Praize the Lord Phil, I’m glad that you, your mama, and grandmama said “yes” to the Lord & MEANT IT!!! That means OBEYING G-O-D & HIS WORD—-ALL OF IT. SHAME, SHAME, SHAME! These people really scare me.
First of all that’s what happens when you”play” w/ the devil,YOU BECOME CONFUSED!!! And everything that Kim said was confusing & made no sense at all. Being familiar w/ the COGIC and it’s rules and regulations—they FORBID “their people” from mingling with the world.
But most importantly, looking past the COGIC & it’s man made rules and regulations,
G-O-D FORBIDS ALL OF HIS CHILDREN FROM MINGLING WITH THE WORLD, and HE made it perfectly clear in HIS instructions/WORD/TRUTH to us…
Seems as though Kim and Judith (who as they describe themselves are so holy and anointed by GOD and supposedly love HIM so much and know and follow the Lord and HIS Word to a “T”) have come down with a case of amnesia.
The sick part of it is, Judith has the audacity to TRY and back up and defend Kim’s actions w/ scripture, but the very scriptures she used (if she was truly filled & led by the Holy Ghost) is whipping Kim. For ex: Matt. 5:13
“You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled by men”. Kim has lost her salt and is no longer good for anything and is about to be thrown out and trampled by men.
Proverbs 6:16-19
“There are six things the LORD hates, seven that are detestable to him:
haughty eyes, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood,
a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are quick to rush into evil, a false witness who pours out lies and a man who stirs up dissension among brothers”.
Kim is operating in all these things at the present, and so is the so-called President, Judith whose eyes are on the money that Kim is going to give her!
Matt. 12:36
“But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken”.
Every word that Kim spoke, to a True Believer, was DUMB, and she WILL have to give an account to The ALMIGHTY for the DUMB words that she spoke.
Because it is the Word of the Lord that True Believer’s are to follow and live by, I say this to Kim and Judith…
2 Cor. 6:16-18 says,
“What agreement is there between the temple of God and idols? For we are the temple of the living God. As God has said: “I will live with them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people”. “Therefore come out from among them (non believer’s) and be separate (sever/cut yourself LOOSE)”, says the Lord. “Touch NO unclean thing, and I will receive you.” “I will be a Father to you, and you will be my sons and daughters, says the Lord Almighty.”
But since she is the “new” Kim Burrell I’m going to tell it to her and Judith in a “new” version…
“Don’t become partners with those who reject God. How can you make a partnership out of right and wrong? That’s not partnership; that’s war. Is light best friends with dark? Does Christ go strolling with the Devil? Do trust and mistrust hold hands? Who would think of setting up pagan idols in God’s holy Temple? But that is exactly what we are, each of us a temple in whom God lives. God himself put it this way:
“I’ll live in them, move into them;
I’ll be their God and they’ll be my people.
So leave the corruption and compromise;
leave it for good,” says God.
“Don’t link up with those who will pollute you.
I want you all for myself.
I’ll be a Father to you;
you’ll be sons and daughters to me.”
The Word of the Master, God”. 2 Cor 6:14-18 (mess)
Kim… THIS MEANS YOU!
END OF STORY!!!!
February 21st, 2010 on 7:51 am
chozenby3,
well said
February 21st, 2010 on 7:53 am
ej, when did I get out of jail?
February 21st, 2010 on 9:36 am
And again, are we in Kim and Judy’s life? We need to look on our lives thinking that we “holier than thou” before you examine other folks lives.
And they are not “partners”, they are going to the world to share the gospel as they are directed to do so. And they are going into “the world” which Christians are afraid to do, rather they get fat, get lazy with the word this means physically and mentally, sitting in the four walls in the church, getting fat with fried chicken and having these socials instead of going to a world which is going to hell daily.
This is better than spewing scriptures around to personally attack the individual and instead judging a person’s heart and motive.
February 21st, 2010 on 9:56 am
How do you know that the people who disagree with Kim Burrell are not spreading the gospel?
February 21st, 2010 on 10:02 am
The same thing that some people think they know Kim’s heart and constantly stand in judgment against her and who think they are right all the time instead of judging their own heart and see what is wrong with their heart. They don’t have anything better to do with their time.
February 21st, 2010 on 12:10 pm
You are doing the same thing, judging everyones heart. I dont see the difference at all.
People have a right to disagree with her especially if they dont think it stands up to the word of God.
You always say people think they are “holier than thou” and that seems to be your only defence.
What I think would shut people up is if you had a scriptural basis for your defence apart from “people are holier than thou”.
According to scripture is this a good idea?
At the end of the post, this is what ej put, “Thoughts???”
The whole point is for people to say what they think.
February 21st, 2010 on 12:20 pm
One thing I do know is that we should be weary when the world starts to love us. That in and of itself is a big red flag according to the bible.
February 21st, 2010 on 3:07 pm
Gayle,
No one is in their (Kim & Judith’s) lives-quite frankly, I COULD CARE LESS!!! But when these people are in “spotlight” so to speak portraying actions that are CONTRARY to GOD and HIS WORD/COMMANDMENTS, that’s when I have a problem. This is sending confusing mixed messages to the church and the next generation. I have children, as well as many others, who are training their seeds up in the UNADULTERATED WORD OF GOD, which is the TRUTH! That was not my OPINION, that was the WORD OF GOD, which I can tell a lot of people on this sight do not read, none-the-less FOLLOW! So if you have a problem with the SCRIPTURE that (we as Believer’s have been commanded to LIVE BY, JESUS) I posted,
TAKE IT UP WITH HIM, cause it’s the TRUTH anyhow, and AIN’T NOBODY MAD but the devil!!!
My 10 yr old son has something to say…
Stop sticking up for kim and stick up for JESUS because you are sticking up for a devil
February 21st, 2010 on 4:07 pm
Chosen,
I know the word, thank you–no argument about that. You have a right to your own opinion and that is fine. We are all adults here.
But I’m not going to sit here and being judged by you and Paul and many others on here judging my Christianity just because I have a difference of opinion. I don’t really have time for that kind of foolishness.
@ Paul…
Yes, EJ wants thoughts, but he does not want posts that start division as well, which you and others here who feel that a person have a difference of opinion and defending people in the body of Christ, but in your opinion, they are no less of a Christian. Look, everyone is trying to grow in their faith and everyone falls and fails. Those who support Kim are not “perfect” and far from it–I’m saying it in love and concern.
I am through discussing this topic, because this topic, in my opinion and the other thread has brought the worse in everyone and instead of praying for Kim, there is way too much condemnation against Kim and I feel that is not right.
God Bless You..
February 21st, 2010 on 4:59 pm
Ok so i kinda understand what was said but a simple yes or no would have sufficed! I do love Kim Burrell and appreciate the gift that GOD has placed in her life but i don’t wanna see or hear about her doing a album that DOESN’T represent Christ! She has impacted so many people and would let so many down that needs someone to look up to and isn’t strong enough to stand on their own feet in GOD. GOD BLESS and i pray his strength and guidance leads her in the right path!
February 21st, 2010 on 5:35 pm
I ditto everyone’s comments who asked “Why the fish net stockings and the cleavage? ” Do Evangelists have to take their clothes off to “minister” to the lost? For all of you who keep saying the “church” is the problem. How many “secular” or non-church industries pay these gospel artists $1000s of dollars to sing at their establishment? Few, the rest of the year they are church hopping.
They should stop using the church for singing events if they don’t think the church is good enough. The church is guilty of permitting them these artists for using it for entertainment purposes. Now these so-called ministers etc. think they are celebrities. They are disrespecting the church and totally unappreciative. I say let them play with fire, they will get burned.
February 21st, 2010 on 9:03 pm
I have mixed emotions about the whole statement. I am kinda confused on the whole thing. What is Kim trying to do? She says that she is not singing secular, she fears God, she would never do anything to displease God, etc. If she is not singing Gospel, then what is she trying to do? Is she trying to sing inspirational songs that would draw the sinners in? I understand that preaching to the choir to sinners might be too harsh but Jesus said that the truth will make you free, you can`t be concerned about hurting people feelings, you tell them the truth regardless of how hurt they may be! Jesus was bold so why can`t his servants be? I will admit that I jumped to conclusions but I do wonder what Kim is trying to do. She never really made it clear what she is doing, you can`t serve God in the world. You can`t water down the gospel just to draw sinners in,but you can take a difference approach!
February 21st, 2010 on 9:11 pm
Please Please Please Please……all this yappin’ and scripture slinging! Stop it for the love of God! It’s been said twenty thousand times. Let the woman sing the Star Bangled Banner if she wants too. If you don’t like it – stop burning, stealing or buying her music. All this talk and people are still going to hell while we debate. Get out there and do something and get results. Let God be the ultimate judge, He’s really good at that and He doesn’t need your help.
I recall BeBe & CeCe, Yolanda Adams, Kirk Franklin and Mary Mary enduring this same scrutiny and garbage coming from so-called believers and now we love ‘em to pieces. I guess you’ll be loving Kim more after she blows up too. Same ole’ traditions and same ole’ mindsets that are not keyed into the fact that the world has changed and God’s ways and methods can sometimes surpass our understanding. Get with it people!
February 22nd, 2010 on 12:08 pm
Gayle,
why is their a division? there is going to be when the word of God is used to examine a situation since some think it is wrong to use scripture (I dont get that since the bible says the word of God is powerful and sharper that a two edged sword – Hebrews 4:12)
Christianity will only bring unity when the church is grounded in Gods word and not opinions.
Ephesians 4:13 (New Living Translation)
13 This will continue until we all come to such unity in our faith and knowledge of God’s Son that we will be mature in the Lord, measuring up to the full and complete standard of Christ.
What this situation needs is the Word of God. What does the word say about it?
Does the word commission us to become like the world to reach the world?
Is singing the means to reach the world given by God?
What is the only message that can reach sinners?
Are our methods more powerful than Gods word?
Does Jesus say the world would love us or hate us?
Did Jesus say that we would be persecuted (by the world) when we live for Him?
Did Jesus say He would bring peace or a sword?
Cant take it anymore, people are dying, thats true but what about the Church? the sanctity of the Church must be defended, you may not like what people are saying however they have a right to say it, especially on a blog that asks for opinions.
February 22nd, 2010 on 12:46 pm
The Bible nowhere condemns any particular style of music.The content of the lyrics. Since neither the purpose of music nor the style of music determines whether a Christian should listen to secular music, the content of the lyrics must be considered. While not specifically speaking of music, Philippians 4:8 is an excellent guide for musical lyrics: “Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things.” If we should be thinking about such things, surely those are the things we should invite into our minds through music and lyrics. Can the lyrics in a secular song be true, noble, right, pure, lovely, admirable, excellent, and praiseworthy? If so, then there is nothing wrong with a Christian listening to a secular song of that nature. We haven’t even heard the lyrics yet and you all have put her in hell! Aren’t you supposed to build instead of tear down? How do you think she feels about this? She has ministered to you, prayed for you, etc and yet this is how you treat her? Wow! Be careful what you say about your fellow christian.
February 22nd, 2010 on 2:00 pm
I never questioned style of music, however if you are going to sing inspirational music as a Christian it would be impossible to leave Christ out, so whats the motive or the point? Also this is an industry ran by sinners? should like and darkness mix in such a manner?
If the music doesnt lift up Christ it cannot lead to Christ at all, so something is a bit off with the letter.
Phil 4:8 is a means of glorifying Christ in your thought life, so again it ends up with Christ. The bible is not telling sinners to think on these things so you must make that distinction. Its is always to glorify the Most High, so how is He left out and again whats the point?
Also, how can people overlook her “sexy” picture? I dont get where the church is coming from.
Should all the women in the Church start taking pictures with sexy stockings and cleavage and start wearing tight clothing if they lose weight.
Its not about tearing down Kim Burrell but what is the standard, is everything ok?
February 22nd, 2010 on 2:30 pm
OMG…please lay OFF the stockings….good grief! The way I dress for work…is the SAME way I would dress for church. Which means I would wear some fish nets with a skirt to my knees (or lower), no clevage sh0wing and a bad pair of heels.
I DEFINITELY have an issue with clevage as well…but can you PLEASE come off the stockings???????
February 22nd, 2010 on 3:04 pm
LOL @ sexy stockings comment! Won’t bother going there…
What industry isn’t ran by sinners? Just curious…
February 22nd, 2010 on 4:32 pm
HA! The comments onthis board (and elsewhere range from the “super-deep” to the “insanely stupid.” I’m so sick of church folk being FAKE and IGNORANT (on either side). Let’s call this for what it is. If you want to really “keep it real”, don’t insult anyone’s intelligence and label this a “misistry decision.” Kim’s last album FLOPPED. She dropped a lot of weight, rebranded her image, and yes, it was HER WEBSITE that used the word “secular.” No one grabbed that word out of mid air and decided to attribute it to her.
This is a BUSINESS DECISION, and it is all about MONEY (like so many other things in the church). Now, to keep her position as the VICE PRESIDENT OF THE INTERNATIONAL MUSIC DEPARTMENT of COGIC, she issues this “damage control” statement, which is laden with a bunch of meaningless religious diatribes about people “not feeling comfortable in our churches” and her dedication to the church. This is ridiculous. If you want to do secular music, fine, but don’t try to say you’re doing it to “reach more poeple’s souls.” This is a career move, nothing more, and all of you who keep saying ***EDITED FOR DISRESPECT*** stuff about “reaching people outside of the 4 walls of the church” are ***EDITED FOR DISRESPECT***! LOL
BTW, with all of this uproar over “secular” music, I haven’t heard anyone mention her plans to have a “reality show”, where you can catch up with all the “drama” with her backstage, and “meet all of her celebrity friends.” Is that “minnistry, too? Again, this wouldn’t be such an issue if she hadn’t accepted a position in the National COGIC and was just the entertainer she’s always been, but don’t ridicule the “church folk” for being rightfully confused by all the double talk and intelligence-insulting that’s going on.
February 22nd, 2010 on 4:32 pm
This is not about the music,the main concern is the people behind the Music Industry. The same people who are in control of Hollywood are the same people who are in charge of the Music Industry. They are not your Alleluia,Thank You Jesus, type people. The Music Industry is one of the most dishonest corporation,they will steal your material and rip you off. They are Foul and Vicious.Every year 1000s upon 1000s upon 1000s travel to Hollywood and major cities NY,Chicago,etc. where recording studios are with stars in there eyes of being a movie star or snagging a recording contract.Sad to say the majority will end up on drugs, being turn out by a pimp,homeless,or doing pornography,Male and female.Their is a percentage that they can’t account for,Law Enforcement assume they return to their home town, rape and dump,being held as sex slaves,or murder as a Satanic sacrifice! Charisma christian magazine also did an article on the same issue. Dressing sexy,showing cleavage is a Big Multi-Billion Dollars Business. Appearance is everything! Luke 12:34 For where your treasure is,there will your heart be also.
February 22nd, 2010 on 4:43 pm
@Loopy– great to hear your view and I appreciate your comment, but I’ma need you to reign in the name calling. You’ve been edited just a tad, but I left the substance of what you’ve said. Thanks!
If you need further guidance on the House Rules, you can check ‘em out at http://www.gospelpundit.com/house-rules.
February 22nd, 2010 on 6:45 pm
I don’t know why anyone is surprised that the Music Department would stand up for Kim Burrell she is a VP. Plus we must all remember the Presiding Bishop has people in his church that sing secular music so what did you all expect. The COGIC has no standard when it comes to these kind of issues.
February 22nd, 2010 on 7:05 pm
In the last and evil days even the greatest will be decieved!
February 22nd, 2010 on 9:22 pm
MeMe…regardless of how you may feel about this issue, dont start attacking Bishop Blake because of who attends his ministry. This isn’t about him. This particular blog is about Kim, her comments and Dr. McCallister’s/the National Music Dept.’s response to it…be careful talking about pastors, churches, or denominations.
February 22nd, 2010 on 9:46 pm
@ Tami, what will happen if she doesn’t…people slay me with that “don’t talk about my pasa” stuff…LOL
February 23rd, 2010 on 4:55 am
@Tami, you must go to his church. First of all the statement was not at Bishop Blake, and I know you don’t want to go there either.
February 23rd, 2010 on 5:17 am
2 Timothy 4: 2 Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct,rebuke, and encourage-with great patience and careful instruction. For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine., Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
February 23rd, 2010 on 7:24 am
This is confusing and just surface! If Sis Burrell wasn’t in this situation of the possibility of compromise.. The Church would not have to make the official declaration of clarity and support! In all the good wording that was said or written! It still was not clarified what the Vice-President and Evangelist of The Church Of God In Christ will be singing! I hope COGIC is not covering this up because they want no bad blood with Kim Burrell and she make the church in a whole look good! especially the Music Dept??? Let’s Just Put The Clark’s Back In Position And It won’t be a problem???
February 23rd, 2010 on 8:25 am
Let me clarify something to you Meme if I’m not mistaken these are you words verbatim ‘Plus we must all remember the Presiding Bishop has people in his church that sing secular music so what did you all expect. The COGIC has no standard when it comes to these kind of issues.’ Obviously the only presiding bishop you’re referring to is Bishop Blake…I am not a member of his church nor do I have to be a member of his flock to take up for him. I really wouldn’t care who’s pastor/church or denomination was being attacked, I personally can’t stand when ‘the saints’ do that. And by the way, there are tons of churches in this world that ‘secular artists/entertainers’ attend. What’s the big deal??
You’re entitled to your opinion, I’m not fighting that at all. Just don’t start attacking our leaders.
The issue at hand is about Kim…do I agree with everything I see and hear regarding her choices?…not really. However I do adore and respect her vocally and I plan to buy her project when it comes out…that’s my choice. I just pray that she holds up a standard in whatever she does. After I hear the project, then I will judge it…
February 23rd, 2010 on 8:43 am
SoGr8tful, the picture is innapropriate according to scripture and that all that should matter. I am a married man and I would never let my wife go out with a skirt with her knee’s showing with long stockings and i dont see in any where scripture would support that.
No woman of God should be trying to wear anything that looks “sexy”, thats not what Christ has called his women of God to do.
http://earlychurch.com/ModestDress.php
1 Timothy 2:9 (Amplified Bible)
9Also [I desire] that women should adorn themselves modestly and appropriately and sensibly….
Why is it wrong to follow the Word of God? whats the problem, is God wrong or does he have our best interest at heart?
God does not want a man looking at your body and lusting after you, thats the problem! Gods wants people to honour and respect you for the way you carry yourself in Christ.
We are following the world too much and have lowered the standards of scripture and Christianity and its heart breaking.
Blessings!!
February 23rd, 2010 on 8:56 am
Tami, Sad to say but a Church many times is a refelction of its leadership.
I would think a big situation like this would be approved by the head since it is a national and somewhat international situation?
February 23rd, 2010 on 9:01 am
It’s Just A Mess All The Way Around!
February 23rd, 2010 on 9:07 am
Paul you are absolutely right. Unfortunately that does happen. I’m more than sure Dr. McCallister cooresponded with Bishop regarding the letter and it’s contents. They decided to support her and allow her to keep her position. So…again do I agree with all of it, not necessarily, but I just can’t stand attacks on our leaders. And sometimes yes, they do bring things on themselves so I’m not naive to that fact at all.
February 23rd, 2010 on 10:34 am
Is an expression of an opinion contrary to a leader’s action(s)/opinion(s)/policy(ies) considered an “attack” on said leader?
February 23rd, 2010 on 10:50 am
Everybody has a right to their own ‘opinion’ and it’s cool to express it. But we have to realize there is a thin line between voicing your opinion and just being nasty. You know the old saying ‘it’s not what you say it’s how you say it’…
February 23rd, 2010 on 10:59 am
As you say, Tami: “it’s not what you say it’s how you say it”, then what was SAID on this board that compels you to label such as an “attack” on ths COGIC Presiding Bishop’s nature or character? Looks like there’s some disagreement of opinion on the leadership, but no one has called Bishop Blake out of his name.
And this post/conversation is relevant because it does relate to even how Kim Burrell has been discussed here. Her ACTIONS have been questioned, but neither her nature nor her character have been defamed in any way, from what I can tell here. The fishnets? From a stylistic perspective, I would have advised her to do something different. The “reincarnation of her career” via this image rehab? Not liking it so far (Loopy pretty much explained the deal behind all of this) and I shouldn’t have to qualify my disagreement about the image rehab with “But I still love Kim”. My love and respect for Kim and her music has never changed.
I STILL hope that she hasn’t sold her soul, either.
February 23rd, 2010 on 11:14 am
Well, I think it’s very odd how one could take a stance in keeping holiness and sanctification in the church, but yet she has managed to go secular while maintaining positions in the church. That’s NOT right! How are we supposed to minister to the world and we’re doing what they are doing? I’m not saying that we should act as though we’re better but there is a fine line between ministering and selling out, and in my opinion, I think she crossed the line!
February 23rd, 2010 on 11:38 am
@Anonymous:
Where is the line? What determines when the gospel artist has crossed the “The Great Line” that sparks so many responses every single time?
*My question is addressed in agreement you, Anonymous.
I think basic logic has to be applied here. These types of behaviors displayed by artists, such as Kim Burrell cause the same reactions every single time…every single time. I have also observed patterns in those who respond in defense of such absurdities. What is next in attempts to justify Kim’s new presentation. When gospel artist tattoo “666″ on their heads, I guess the response will be to avoid judging them for just expressing art and using basic numbers. Right? Right? Class?
February 23rd, 2010 on 12:04 pm
TamTam I was referring to the comment MeMe made: ‘Plus we must all remember the Presiding Bishop has people in his church that sing secular music so what did you all expect. The COGIC has no standard when it comes to these kind of issues.’
I never said anyone called him out of his name. I just thought that comment especially about the national church was uncalled for. Again, we all have a right to our opinion…
My stance is simply this. I am a lover of music. Do I buy and listen to anything outside of gospel and jazz absolutely not. I happy for Kim, as far as her new look, etc. I’m like you TamTam I just pray she doesn’t sell out. Especially since the COGIC is supporting her decision. That would be a major slap in the face to them.
Over 20 years ago I had the chance to sing background for Gladys Knight. I was honored as I don’t know what!…after I got off of the phone with her now late son, the holy ghost in me said absolutely not! I couldn’t do it and I don’t regret it and the Lord has blessed my ministry abundantly. That was my conviction…
February 23rd, 2010 on 12:22 pm
So noted, Tami….
And I was raised COGIC, BTW… and although I don’t attend a COGIC church as an adult, I do regard and respect the structure, so on and so forth…. Don’t always agree with it, but I acknowledge it.
I think the larger question around this entire topic has to do with the extent of the role of individual (Kim herself) choices versus organizational (COGIC) responsibility. This press release seeks to BRIDGE the widening gap of Kim’s choices to the Christian/COGIC doctrine/belief system, esp. since Kim is has a COGIC title/role/function.
At the end of the day, this press release did a POOR JOB of closing that gap. It didn’t address the biblical/spiritual aspects, possibly in part to avoid alienating portions of those COGIC members who do sing secular…. Hmmm…. Uh oh!!!!
February 23rd, 2010 on 12:49 pm
Well obviously I am COGIC to the bone LOL! I joined it 21 years ago I wasn’t born in it (a lil COGIC humor)…
Anyway I agree with you 100%. I was praying there would be more substance to Kim’s remarks and I wanted to hear a little more from Dr. McCallister and the church.
February 23rd, 2010 on 1:03 pm
@ Paul N – did you read my first comment carefully? I am “only” relating to the stockings….not the entire wardrobe. No need to quote the word because I know how to properly dress for church and work. I stated (if you read my first comment correctly) that I do NOT like clevage being shown and I DON’T allow that on myself. However, there is nothing wrong with the stockings. As long as woman makes sure the clothing is not tight, low clevage or too short, I am ok with that. My preference may be different from hers, but again, if you read my first post carefully, you will see that I stated my dress code preference.
As long as my skirt is (at least) at my knee cap and below….there’s nothing wrong. (in my opinion)
February 23rd, 2010 on 1:12 pm
@Tami. That is your opinion and that is great, but now the true hurts and I understand. I am a member of the COGIC and have been for 25 years now. I have worked with all of these leaders and know what I am talking about. I say it again they will do whatever it takes to cover something or somebody up. They make the rules up as they go. If this was the Clark Sisters they would be trying to kill them.
February 23rd, 2010 on 1:30 pm
@ SoGr8tful – I’m with you concerning the ‘sexy stockings’, lol. The thing about clothes is that it’s all in how you rock them…and where. I don’t agree with the style choices for her web photos. In the end, I think it’s caused unnecessary confusion and division. I completely agree with owning fishnets and leather-like leggings though, lol…if you know when and HOW to rock them.
Ultimately, I think this press release should have crossed the desk of a copy writer or PR person before it was released. I think it was released with good intentions but the wording has created even more confusion…adding fuel to the fire.
February 23rd, 2010 on 2:09 pm
MeMe-well I can’t comment on that because I never worked on the national level. But because of your position or previous position I think that should be more of a reason to not through that info. out there for the wolves, although it may very well be true…just my opinion. but I’m sure the national church is getting hit hard with all of this.
v4c-I agree with the wardrobe comment. I think the photos pushed it a little. I know she wants to show off her weight loss, but something more conservative but flattering would have been great. Come on though you can’t deny she looks wonderful!
February 23rd, 2010 on 2:41 pm
Reading all of the comments I only hope that Kim is doing the right thing. There is alot of comments for and against her. The church is serious and there is a standard that has to be adhere to. MY flesh wants things too but, I am striving to obey God so I will not fulfill the lust of the flesh. We are not of the world we are only in it. I saw Kim outfit on The Award Show a little suggestive with the one arm out. I believe its only the beginning. We as christian do thing we have to make sure Christ is in it. Isn’t that the name Christ in the word christian. I listen to alot of gospel and there are time I don’t here Jesus name or the name Christ, but isn’t this what it’s all about. Jesus has spoken to us all thru his word if I be lifted up I will draw allmen unto me.
February 23rd, 2010 on 2:47 pm
@ Tami – Oh, the slimmer look is fab! Gotta give her that.
I just feel like if Kim’s real mission is to expand to a wider audience, they should’ve taken all audiences perception into consideration. It would’ve been easy to choose attire that would’ve worked stylistically for everyone. And from the style options present on the web photos, it doesn’t seem like that happened. This really didn’t have to be an issue…
February 23rd, 2010 on 6:10 pm
@ v4c – I totally agree! Maybe it would be best to look for another wardrobe assistant – whom knows what is very appropriate for her size yet allows her to still look fierce.
)
February 23rd, 2010 on 8:30 pm
I do not think this is a good idea at all. Has she talked with God and did He said it was okay to do this? I do not agree and she should not be doing this because it’s not ministry and it’s not getting people saved. She’s just entertaining people and I don’t think God wanted her gift to be used like that. It’s wrong it’s not right and this is a very bad decision.
February 23rd, 2010 on 9:21 pm
The church has aways embraced its sacred and holy music called “Gospel” which is the “Good News” of Jesus Christ. The church has also embraced gospel music so much until we have locked it and it’s message within the four walls of our houses of worship every Sunday morning at 11:00 am. The church seems to enbrace our anoited singers as long as they are within the four walls because we don’t really think that God can use our singers no other place then our churches. Go ye there fore, means just that. You can’t reach unsaved people the traditional approach we’ve become accustom and comfortable with. We want our singers to fish, but we want to tell them how and where, and what type of fish to pull in. Some saints watch others fish, some wonder when others will start, and then there are those who pick a target as there job. A fishing pole is as good as the person using it. Kim, take the anoiting with you and fish your way right into glory… by any Holy Ghost means nessasary! The door is open now my sister, prepare the way for Jesus to come in. Eld. MVB
February 23rd, 2010 on 9:42 pm
@ Elder Brown,C.O.G.I.C…..The question is, what type of bait is Miss Burrell using?
February 23rd, 2010 on 11:23 pm
@Tami – I hear you, I just wanted you to know I would not say what I said if I did not know what I was talking about. I love my church and pray they will do the right thing. We are good.
February 24th, 2010 on 8:00 am
MeMe-I gotcha
February 24th, 2010 on 9:30 am
Kim is simply allowing God to expand her territory. To presume anything else is ridiculous and shameful. God obviously has invested a great deal of talent and anointing in her, and the body of Christ should rejoice that one of its daughters is being celebrated world wide.
February 24th, 2010 on 11:40 am
John 15:19 (New King James Version)
19 If you were of the world, the world would love its own. Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.
February 24th, 2010 on 1:06 pm
I love Kim Burrell. She is my sister in Christ as well as a great singer. I am not concerned by her releasing a secular album, wearing fishnet stockings or showing cleavage. My responsibility is to pray for her and to be obedient to the voice of the Lord and his word in my life. She’s God’s child, not mine.
February 24th, 2010 on 1:23 pm
Ok. Let’s stop it! This is pitiful. Now to whomever think that she should not hold leadership position because she is going secular or whatever you want to call it is not right. No leader is perfect! Comparing what Kim is doing is nothing to what some of these pastors, teachers, preachers, deacons, singers, etc. have done. If you feel she need to be removed from leadership, are you going to remove pastors who have stolen money, committed aldultery, deacons that have committed adultery, etc. Are you going to listen to gospel singers who are gay? Give me a break! You are the very reason why people do not attend church! Where is the building up? You are tearing her down and haven’t even listen to the songs she is going to present to her. Do you know how hurtful these comments are especially of her own people! I’m glad you don’t determine whether she goes to hell or not. Leave this lady alone!
February 24th, 2010 on 2:02 pm
Ok, Yvette: you do realize that this press release escalated this story, right? I kind of had been left alone until this (poor excuse for) statement was released…. I think folk were (at least I was) in a “wait and see” mode because we know (or believed) Kim’s reputation as a defender of the gospel so we were giving her the benefit of the doubt. However, this statement has done more harm than good, not only for Kim, but for the COGIC Music Dept.
I’m just saying….
Criticism isn’t the reason folk leave or don’t come to church. INCONSISTENCY is…. Revelation 3:16 “So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth”
February 24th, 2010 on 2:49 pm
I’m curious to know what you think about the Press Release EJ, lol. Since you haven’t told us yet…
*hoping EJ takes the bait*
February 24th, 2010 on 4:05 pm
People will always manipulate the word to support their views, causes, motives and agendas. That’s why it’s so important
to go directly to the Sovereign Source for the specifics for our own lives. Only he knows what’s best for us as individuals. God can uphold her integrity even among the “secular” scene.
February 24th, 2010 on 8:30 pm
@ Yvette…..I Corinthians 5 starting in verse 9..I have written you in my letter NOT TO ASSOCIATE with sexually immoral people -not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. But now I am writing you that YOU MUST NOT ASSOCIATE WITH ANYONE WHO CALLS HIMSELF A BROTHER, BUT IS SEXUALLY IMMORAL OR GREEDY, AN IDOLATER OR A SLANDERER, A DRUNKARD OR A SWINDLER. WITH SUCH A MAN DO NOT EVEN EAT. What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? ARE YOU NOT TO JUDGE THOSE INSIDE? God will judge those outside. EXPEL THE WICKED MAN FROM AMONG YOU?
February 25th, 2010 on 12:35 pm
Did Jesus expelled you? Do you really think that getting rid of Kim Burrell will make your COGIC religion better? For Real? For Real? By the way, Jesus would not get rid of Kim. He had compassion and that’s what you’re lacking. I say, tell the Lawd to come and get you right now because he has no use for you here anymore. You’re perfect! He can’t use perfect people.
February 25th, 2010 on 1:08 pm
@EJ, I do apologize if anything I said was disrespectful in any way. I tend to get a little overpassionate at times! Again, I sincerely apologize. (Just for clarification, I didn’t cuss, saints!! LOL)
Again I say, this is a business decision on the part of Kim Burrell, and the COGIC church is catiously supporting her as of now so as to not have any egg on their face. This is NOT, I repeat, NOT a ministry decision, and quite frankly I am sick and tired of church folk doing what they want to do and trying to qualify it with ridiculous statements about “trying to win more souls.”
Bottom line, Kim is under new management and is rebranding herself. If you want to follow her, check out the upcoming reality show on vh1. Meanwhile, instead of making all kinds of blanket statements and comments you could feel free to actually READ what’s going on. NOTE who used the word SECULAR.
http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/news.php?id=48237
http://outercourttalk.com/2010/02/shocking-news-kim-burrell-loses-over-100lbs-relaunches-her-career-as-a-secular-artist/
http://vodpod.com/watch/2871889-kim-burrell-krishnar-lewis-microdine-product-launch
February 26th, 2010 on 10:02 am
I’m amazed at what I’m reading. @ Mike the messenger. Jesus said he who is without sin, cast the first stone. Sometimes church folks can be so legalistic in the approach to the point of forgetting that it’s love that is the more excellent way. I believe that the earth is the Lords and the fullest there of, wholeheartedly. That all things created was created by God. I believe that God can inspire a love or inspirational song, just as he inspires a praise & worship or one of those gospel blues songs. I don’t know what my sister Kim Burell is working on right now but I do know that this crucifixion of her is not the example that Jesus left for us to follow. Can we believe the word of God pertaining to her life? That the great work that He began in her, He will complete. I’m believing that whatever the case, God will get the glory from her life and people will be lead to Christ by her testimony.
February 26th, 2010 on 12:48 pm
I believe we have to many Star-Stuck Christians! Just because someone has gain material wealth and you see than on the big stage with a spotlight shining on them, that don’t make than Holy or Just. You can be Anointed,and Gifted and still Miss Heaven! We as Christian are to Judge:1. to form a opinion about 2. to criticize or censure 3. to think. Read Proverbs, it tells us about wicked people,loose women,thugs,and virtuous woman. Proverbs describe their demeanor,outward behavior, and conduct. Actions speaks tons of volume. We have too many Carnal Christians,we Act,Walk,Talk,and Dress just like the World! What are we Saved From if we are Imitating the WORLD?
February 26th, 2010 on 12:52 pm
The late Presiding Bishop J.O. Patterson said this “saints you don’t have to go acting like the world to make a dollar..the bible says be no conformed to this world”……Nobody is judging. People want to use the word JUDGE..but no one don’t want to be CONVICTED!!! All im going to say is that the holy ghost speaks for itself as well as the anointing. We must realize that the bible speaks about a “FORM OF godliness” Just because it may look or sound like…Well its not..We are in the last days..Let pray..Jesus is coming soon..Remember its “HOLINESS IS STILL RIGHT”
February 26th, 2010 on 3:39 pm
Jesus also said, he who is without sin, let him cast the first stone. I’ll say this again. God is able to keep us in all of our ways. Pray that He keeps her and stop trying to remove the splinter from her eye when there may be a beam in yours.
February 26th, 2010 on 4:50 pm
I agree Desiree Sweep around your own backdoor before your try and sweep around someone’s else. And who said that singing non-christian music is acting like the world?
February 26th, 2010 on 4:58 pm
Misapply,misread, and misuse scripture. God is able to keep us in HIS WAY,not OUR WAY! The Narrow and Straight, or the Broad or Wide. The choice is yours.
February 28th, 2010 on 6:05 pm
Yah, not secular…but in this video, her partner gives an “exclusive” with her right by her side, where he calls it an “Inspirational Secular Record” and she tells him he’s saying “all the right things”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fuw0HS38F6A
…but that’s what “they” call it…yah…riiiiiiggght…
February 28th, 2010 on 11:44 pm
Their is nothing wrong with stepping out of the gospel ring for a while. No one said she was leaving God! Singing other genres are not ungodly. I am always looking for something else to listen to during diner or just to relax. Not anything degrading. How about you look at it a different way. When you are spend intimate time with your spouse. Are you going to be listening to “souled out” over a candle light dinner? Or,
We all go to work and school on a daily basis. Would you not work at your present job because everyone there is not saved! Should we only go to christian schools? That is sad! Why not strive to be more Christ-like Christians and love others no matter what and let God handle the rest!!!!
March 1st, 2010 on 10:00 am
@Radal – Proverbs3:6- In all YOUR ways acknowledge Him, and He will make your path straight. – Baby, I’m a living witness that God can keep you even when you don’t want to be kept! Bottom line – I wish Kim the blessing of the Lord and pray that God will keep her.
March 1st, 2010 on 12:38 pm
*CRACKIN UP LAUGHIN at Shay Renee’s first paragraph* you have a point. LOL
March 1st, 2010 on 9:25 pm
In the bible they have the seven churches and one had many critics there so that’s where were at now critical folks in the church today….WATCH WHO YOU EXPOSE AND PUT DOWN….IT’S GONNA COME RIGHT BACK TO YOU….
March 2nd, 2010 on 2:53 pm
Wow, I too am somewhat confused by the letter issued by our In’tl President Judy McCallister along with Kim Burrell. I respect both of them highly however, is she or isn’t she singing secular music? I mean this wouldn’t be the first time in the history of COGIC that one of it’s leaders actively interacted with secular recording artist. Remember Bebee & CeCe & Whitney Houston, or Karen Clark Sheard and Faith Evans or the many other artists.
Here’s how I see it. We have many celebrity secular folks who are apart of our church. They are recognized when they come to the conventions however, other than Stevie Wonder, they are seldom asked to sing or give any type of expressions and in many cases they shouldn’t. Yet, there are those who judge them and those who acknowledge their presence and pray for them.
My issue is concerning our young people. We as adults, saved and santified people have to be clear about our own salvation and lifestyle. The bible says to be careful for nothing, meaning even though the participation may be innocent, how will the example be preceived. Because we are all living advertisment for the Lord. Our young folks are already confused about many issues, do we really need to give them one more thing to question??? Who’s to say Kim Burrell starts off innocently singing about lifes issues but then being under contract her management decides they are going to have ger appear with let’s say Snoop dogg… I know that may be a little far fetched but it could become a reality what then? what will be the excuse at that point?
In everything we do, we have to do things prayerfully and with conviction because others are watching… Who’s watching you???
March 4th, 2010 on 7:29 pm
The harvest is truly plentiful and the laborers are few. The call is not for the “laborer” to “become like” those being harvested in order to do the work of the Lord. Sounds like just another “money changer” in disguise. Stick to what you were called to do!!!
March 8th, 2010 on 1:40 am
Kim burrell is a great singer dnt gt me wrong bt i am disgusted wt the choice that she made. The bible says u cnt be light and darkness so u cnt be filled wt his most precious gift and sing secular music. Kim better be glad im nt dr mccalister becuase i wud nt hav been on her side n hav kucked her off. N her website shows the most oppisite of filled wt the holy ghost. We all need to pray for her
March 8th, 2010 on 1:56 am
EJ, don’t you think you should close this thread? I think there is too much scripture slinging and corrupt communication up in here instead of respecting one another and its gonna get worse. I think this thread in my opinion has ran his course.
March 12th, 2010 on 11:20 am
I have read what Ms. Burrell and Dr. McAllister are saying…but the nowhere in scripture you will find that Jesus ever became a sinner or a publican to witness to or draw them. He remained constant in who he was, delivered his message and showed them love by telling they the benefits of them becoming saved & turning away from their sins and unrighteousness. He also shared with them the fact that they didn’t give their lives completely to God, then they would go to hell. JESUS loved and loves mankind enough to tell them the truth.
Now…make no mistake about it….I love people…whether they’re saved or not and God loves them more.
There was a statement where Ms. Burrell said that secular artist feel condemned and unwelcomed. We as true Christians shouldn’t try to make anyone feel unwelcomed when they’re in our presence or at church. But I believe that it is the presence of the Holy Spirit in a true Christian life that makes someone who is not a true Christian feel uncomfortable and condemned. Jesus said that he himself did not come to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. If you’re a sinner, we’re not judging you….that’s just the simple truth. And I pray that noone is putting secular artist out of their church because they’re not saved, but even if you’re not a secular artist and you don’t KNOW JESUS CHRIST as your personal savior….there is a sense of CONVICTION that comes over you when you’re in the presence of a true Christian. I believe that many people get CONDEMNATION and CONVICTION mixed up.
There are some cases where church folks have condemned people to hell over things, but that isn’t the case ALL THE TIME.
Many secular artist may feel bad because although they have not SURRENDERED their lives over the God, they do love him to the best of their ability and knowledge. But if we love God, then we’ll serve him, obey him, deny ourselves, etc.
The Word of God and His presence CONVICTS us and calls us to repentance, but we still have to CHOOSE to repent and give our lives totally over to God. When we are CONDEMNED then we are ruled unfit without any hope of redemption. And that’s why Jesus said that he didn’t come to condemn us (we get enough of that), but he came to SAVE US!
Gospel Music has become so vast and diverse, until as a Christian, you really don’t have to go anywhere outside of it to find the kind of music that you like. Everything about us is suppose to glorify God. And since I’m talking about Gospel/Christian Music, everything about it should lead a person right back to JESUS CHRIST. The Message of God’s love, forgiveness and what & who he is….is to be projected in Gospel/Christian Music.
But anyway….
Ms. Burrell may or may not be going about it the right way….by openingly joining herself with the secular music world, when the Bible clearly states that we are to make a difference b/w clean and unclean, holy and unholy. I believe that she can draw them in, without becoming one of them.
I also personally believe that if anyone condones, cloaks, excuses or jumps on the bandwagon with her and this move she’s making be not of God….then mighty will be the fall of those people.
Anytime in the Bible when you see the children of Israel yoking up with ungodly things and people…..they always suffered a GREAT FALL.
The Bible tells us to lay aside every weight and sin that will so EASILY BESET US! What Ms. Burrell is doing may not be viewed as a sin, but we have to be very careful & watchful of the Devil. He will creep in unawares and tear things up before we can blink good. God is strategic in his doings and so is the devil. By her doing what she’s doing may mess so many people up.
But this is all just my opinion and take on things.
Love you all
Love you Ms. Kim “Off the Chain” Burrell,
Love you Dr. Judith McAllister
Love you International COGIC
Love you all the Saints/Christians of the Most High God
April 26th, 2010 on 5:19 am
I’ll say it again (and I’m not even COGIC) if you dont stand for something, you’ll fall for anything. If your going to put something in black and white for me, dont lace it with a “testimony” and a whole bunch of church jargon. Just tell the truth and shame the devil. Either your going to sing GOSPEL, SECULAR or INSPIRATIONAL music (which 9 times out of 10 deletes the Name of Jesus out of it and refers to God just as He and Him.
COGIC, do you! because if you dont watch yourself, you’ll end up loosing your holiness roots and standard and come out looking and acting just like your brothers and sisters over at the Assemblies of God and wont know WHAT you believe anymore.
April 28th, 2010 on 4:58 pm
Just like some o’ll “AIN’Ts”!!! All I see is a bunch of people judging and trying to put somebody in hell. I suggest you read 1 Chronicles 16:22 and even a few vurses thereafter. I don’t know what Kim Burrell is doing and I couldn’t care less. I have never really enjoyed her vocal style, but she is a child of God and that is enough for me to watch what I say. I trust that she knows God and she knows what he has for her to do!
If you guys are all as concerned as you are acting to be, you should be in your proverbial prayer closet! Get ta prayin before I tell boss….. BOSS, THEY AIN’T PRAYIN!
May 2nd, 2010 on 9:19 pm
The COGIC needs Iris Stevenson back. We love Dr. McAllister, but the appointment was in mistake and of bad timing. Dr. McAllister would have been a great leader had she waited a little while longer to accept the position. But she is out of time and sync; therefore, everything she does is out of order.
May 3rd, 2010 on 12:17 am
The Kingdom of God is progressive. We need to be wiling to embrace new concepts and methods of delivering the gospel. The message stays the same, but the method must change.
As I reviewed these posts, it is evident that there is much mis-information in regard to the understanding of the mission of Jesus.
My prayer is that God will give us the grace to be able to disagree with one another without being vindictive in our words and comments. When we do so, we are no better than the world, in the spewing of conjecture and innuendo.
If we do no agree or understand, let us make a commitment to PRAY!
Justsayin’
June 8th, 2010 on 10:34 am
I am amazed that the “saints’ will fall for any conversation that allows them to be a little closer to the world. So I guess now we will have some Bishops open up a topless club in the name of winning souls.
Why is it whenever we want to go back in the world we want to go “in Jesus name?”
For years people have been saved by the old fashion gospel, preached by people that have been sold out to God. Now we want to listen to secular music, go secular places and compliment a secular life style.
We used to know what backslid was. We used to know what lost was. Now we just need a little “I love God but all that preachin is turning me off” and we are sold to go along with who ever says it.
Look, to the true saints of God. We are CALLED to be separate from the world. There is no getting around it no matter what someone says. We are told “the path is narrow”. We understand that some will fall form the faith.
Now knowing that why would you fall for this dribble? If she is really in it for the souls then why don’t she donate at least ha;f her earning form this nonsense to the church? I will tell you why, she lost 100 pounds (and still a big momma) so now the snakes have convinced her that she can sing anything and God (and the fake saints) will still believe she is saved. I tell you what, the Bible told us that these days were coming and they are getting closer. God is simply exposing the fakes so the rest of the fakes will raise their hand.
So is your hand up or down?
June 8th, 2010 on 10:55 am
SMH…the day when we stop calling each other fakes, ain’ts, etc. because we disagree with one another will be a good day.
“You don’t disagree with me…you disagree with the Word.” Figured I’d beat you to it, lol.
Yes, one may disagree with your INTERPRETATION of the word but that doesn’t mean he or she loves God any less. Mercy!
June 8th, 2010 on 10:57 am
@v4c– you’ve been here long enough to know that RARELY do I re-enter such a stale discussion, but you just made me HOLLER at “figured I’d beat you to it.”
Cuz you KNOW that response was comin’! HAAAAAAAAA!!!!
So classic.
June 8th, 2010 on 11:14 am
@ EJ – LMBO! I felt it in my Spirit…
June 8th, 2010 on 11:31 am
@Michael Clayton-Are you really separated from the world? You just called her a name, big momma! What is that all about. I am so glad that I have been delievered from people. For many years I allowed people to dictate to me what I could and cannot do especially when it came to being a Christian. I am no longer in Bondage! Praise Jesus. I listen to music that I enjoy. I dance and I sing. If I would have continued to allow the church tell me what I should do and instead of listening to what God tells me, I would be in the nuthouse. Because most of you who say you are saved, sanctified and filled with the HolyGhost and speak in tongues when given the utterance are on your way to hell and don’t even know it. You think you’re better than those who don’t possess the gifts of the spirit, or feel the way you do. You may do all of that in Jesus Name, but if your heart isn’t right, guess where you’re going?
How dare you call yourself so holy to be so judgmental against this Woman of God. Just because you disagree with what Kim is about to do, doesn’t make you any better than she is. Who says that Kim Burrell can’t sing secular? God didn’t say that. That’s what the church folk says. Watch who you put your mouth on. Since you’re so holy and without a speck in your eye, in Matthew 7:1-6, Jesus pointed out that people tend to judge the “speck of sawdust” in another person’s eye when they are oblivious to the “plank” in their own eyes. Being judgmental only makes people hypocrites because they are unable to see their own issues as they judge others. The Bible points out in that “all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God” (Romans 3:23), which means that nobody is in a position to be judgmental about another person’s actions. Even Jesus himself, who was without sin, did not condemn the adulterous woman when others were about to stone her (John 8:1-11). Jesus instead invited the person who was “without sin” to cast the first stone. Thank you and be blessed!
June 8th, 2010 on 12:34 pm
@ Michael Clayton
“and still a big mama”
???
Have you lost your mind? Where is the Christ in that kind of comment? How did you reprove or edify anyone or lead them to the Lord by resorting to name -calling.
You just made me more determined to go out and purchase Kims “secular” CD.
June 8th, 2010 on 3:09 pm
Don’t forget to support the first Bishop that opens a topless club so he can “win souls”.
June 9th, 2010 on 9:17 am
Tearing people down is not my style. God bless you Michael Clayton.
Nobody (but you) said anything about supporting a topless bar sponsored by a bishop.
But your name calling is just as ungodly as you say Kim Burrell’s secular venture is (more even). In your effort to point people to the truth, you yourself have slipped into error.
When you learn how to speak the truth in love, people will receive it and repent. But you don’t wanna see people saved, you just wanna be right. You must be so proud of your accomplishment.
June 9th, 2010 on 9:19 am
@ Michael Clayton,
BTW if God sent me to a topless bar to win souls- to the topless bar I would go. Would you? Could you?
June 9th, 2010 on 9:22 am
These responses are too funny. Let me get this right, everyone can talk about what I d\said, disguised as “love’ (LOL) but Kim is alright. LOL LOL LOL LOL, I think this is too funny. Talk about me, but say nothing about the world. makes sense to me. I am still waiting for some Bishop too open a topless clun in the name of “winning souls” LOL.
June 9th, 2010 on 9:28 am
Nope I would not go. i am just trying to make as much sense of the “non sense” conversation that people put up to justify their still loving the world in the name of Jesus. It is obvious that the Bible is to be debuted here and not believed with the excuse of “winning souls”
I am mostly making these comment because I told a friend of mines that there are more people pretending to be saved with a lot of conversation then really are saved. But I think that my be Bible, LOL.
June 9th, 2010 on 9:49 am
I have several problems with the recent comments you have made:
#1 the name calling (mentioned that one)
#2 accusing people of “loving the world” as if that is wrong. God loves the world, it’s sin that He hates (the world system). But the people of the world- God is CRAZY IN LOVE with them.
#3 “everybody’s saying Kim is alright”- No everybody’s not saying Kim is alright. Most people are PRE-JUDGING before hearing the music. Have you heard the music yet? Then how can you make a judgment call one way or the other? I’m not one who says it’s wrong to judge, but we have to judge with righteous judgment.
Which brings me back to my original point-NAME calling is not God’s way of judging, correcting, rebuking or reproving His people.
So, are you speaking for God or yourself?
June 9th, 2010 on 9:59 am
You are so right, I don’t know why Jesus called Harrod a dog, or why Paul called the people of Crete slow bellies. I guess you got me on that one LOL, yep no name calling.
You got me, I can see you are well versed i n the Word LOL.
Look, we all claim to love God, but we all disagree on his Word. Like I said, these are nothing but excuses people are using to justify loving toe world and the things of the world, I mean, you are right, we should not be separate as the Bilble say, we should pay no attention to what God says in his word. We should all go by are feelings and try to reconcille the Word to our feelings. LOL
June 9th, 2010 on 10:25 am
LOL Michael you are sooooo predictable. I knew you were gonna come back with name-calling references in the bible. As it has been mentioned before, people will use the bible to JUSTIFY ANYTHING- including name calling. I believe slavery was fiercely defended by bad bible interpretation.
Now if you want to have a theological discussion we need to start a new discussion. But I need to point out to you that in scripture CONTEXT IS EVERYTHING.
What Jesus did and what you are doing are TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. JESUS TOLD THE TRUTH- HE CALLED AS HE SAW IT. He called Harod a dog because that was a common name for a gentile during biblical times, and Harod was behaving like a “gentile” (much like you are with your name calling). Also, Harod (forgive the spelling) was a baby killer! He tried to kill Jesus as a child. He sent out his soldiers to slaughter ALL BABY BOYS UNDER TWO YEARS OF AGE IN ISRAEL. Now if that ain’t a DOG – I don’t know what is!
Paul called the Cretans lazy gluttons (sloths, slow bellies-whatever) because they ALREADY HAD THAT NAME AND REPUTATION. He didn’t label them as such (and neither did God)- he was using the vernacular of the world to get a point across.
WHAT YOU ARE DOING IS BEING WORLDLY- CALLING NAMES TO GET A POINT ACROSS INSTEAD OF BRINGING TRUTH TO LIGHT. So in light of the scriptures (which you have misrepresented to prove your point). Do you still think it’s okay to call Kim Burrell “Big Mama” just because she’s singing secular music? Remember she lost that weight becuas of health problems. Are you saying Kim Burrell is just as bad as King Harod or the Cretans just because she is singing secular music. If so, you have some faulty logic and a bit of bible studying to do yourself.
June 9th, 2010 on 10:39 am
As a matter of Fact: I can’t even find the reference of where Jesus called Herod a Dog. I don’t even see where John the Baptist called Herod or any of his descendents a Dog. Where is the reference for that?
June 9th, 2010 on 10:48 am
Based on the Strong’s Concordance you are wrong, but that is a mote point. I personally believe that we should represent God to the best that is available to us and not continue to makes excuses for slothful behavior.
Look, we can still make this really simple. You love what you love and keep on making as though God is a sympathetic punk in the sky. God is a lot harder then you want to believe, but again, that is a mote point. So you believe what you believe what you want and I will believe the Word of God.
June 9th, 2010 on 11:15 am
I don’t care what concordance, lexicon, bible dictionary or commentary you use; whether it’s Strong’s, Matthew Henry, Scofield or whatever; I don’t care if you speak fluent Greek or Hebrew, or Aramaic; there is no justification for your name calling- especially not in the bible- which is the final authority.
Of all the name calling scriptures you could possibly pull up in the bible (a grand total of TWO- one of which is questionable), they are exponentially outnumbered by the scriptures that condemn it.
Kim Burrell does not fit the description of an elder who is taking advantage of the flock by falsely teaching them or leading them away from God or causing them to commit sexual immorality. At the very most from what I can tell, what she is doing is neither good or bad. But like I said when this discussion first started, I will reserved judgment until I hear the music.
EVEN IF IT TURNS OUT THAT KIM BURREL IS JUST LIKE THOSE CRETANS- THE FALSE TEACHERS AND PROPHETS IN TITUS THAT PAUL WAS SPEAKING OF- YOUR NAME CALLING IS STILL UNJUSTIFIED.
Even if you disagree with what she is doing, why call her a “big mama” instead of congratulating her on her weight loss? What does her size have to do with the type of music she is singing or her witness for Christ? You can’t defend calling her out of her name, because you didn’t even do it “biblically” (which I don’t believe is possible anyway).
“But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken. For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”- Matthew 12:36-37
I hate throwing scriptures around, but you really needed that one.
June 9th, 2010 on 11:19 am
And again I ask where is the reference of Jesus calling Herod a dog?
June 9th, 2010 on 11:30 am
Okay, closing comments cuz… it’s just time. Retreat to your neutral corners and pray for one another. Jesus loves you and I do, too.
Amen.
August 26th, 2010 on 1:51 pm
This document wasn't really meant to be a "press release" per say. This document is more or less a transscript of a conference call with the Executive board of the International Music Department (IMD) of the COGIC.
VP Burrell was addressing the allegations/ rumors during this normally scheduled conference call with staff members. How do I know? i was on the call.